No change classic but change tbc

WoW Classic WoW Classic General Discussion
1

Whit the high possibility of a re-release of TBC and what we learned from classic I want to voice my opinions of some changes that I would like to see in TBC with classic spirit in mind.

The first one is the change from raid sizes to be more similar to classic.

Back in time this change was made to make raiding more engaging and get rid of dead weights.
But how we saw in classic, raids will be fairly easy even for the most casual guilds, people are generally more prepared so there is no need to limit it to 25 or 10 man raid, it would be harder to keep 40-20 man raids due of some rooms sizes (attumen or terong gorefiend are the first that comes in mine mind) but im totally positive that there is space for at least 5 extra player making it kara/ZA a 15 man raid (one of the biggest mistake in classic is that we have not seen the original 15 man UBRS or 10 man scholo/stray) and 30 man the others.

Obviously boss hp/damage have to be rebalanced becouse there are 5 more players, but it will make TBC raiding fresh especially with speed running becoming a thing there too. (will guild run with 5 more extra dps or more safer with 1 or 2 extra healer or even an extra tank of 4 dps? The possibility are alot).
This also will allow to bring some litle underperforming class/specs class thnx to having 5 extra slot.

The second one and I know that I will trigger a lot of people with this, Remove arenas and add Rated Bgs instead.

Arenas are the biggest mistake the pvp team did to this game, gameplay wise and lorewise.

How an arena circuit managed by goblins of the steamwhedle cartel should be more important and give better rewards that partipating in the fight between alliance and horde for the controll of tactical resources (the conflict between AvsH is the core of this franchise and blizzard already failed for their incompentce of creating a proper open world pvp setting).
With tbc surelly made by the Shadowlands client, the code of rbgs are already there, and make it work as they where in cata/Mop with the reward being attached to your Bgs CR, the only thing we will lose are the title, but having Warlord as a title surely feels better that those meme that are “insert word+gladiator close to it”

Also gameplay wise they require more coordination and skill compared to burst/run to pillar/ cc/ repeat.

For the rest keep TBC as it was, but this additions could happen, classic TBC would become really CLASSIC

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TBC is made for TBC fans, not for Vanilla fans. If you prefer Vanilla, stay in (Classic) Vanilla.

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3

So you want TBC but not TBC?

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Are people aware that a TBC will be sharded? not layered, but sharded. This is ofc my hypotheses but think about it for a while, how could it not be based on what we know about Classic?

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You are somewhat wrong about raid size and you are wrong about Arena lore wise.

Arena is part of the Lore.
Raid size was reduced so it would be easier for guilds to form and manage raids.

There is no need for major rework either in Classic or TBC.

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I want TBC,

But there is no need to bench 15 players today as it was in 2007.

Becouse now you dont have the problem that for having a competent player in raid you have to carry is 3 friends that die as soon you pull the boss.

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I don’t know about you, but raid sizes being 25m instead of 40m is one of the things I anticipate the most about TBC. 40m raids are a logistical nightmare and it’s hard for most players in it to find room to talk on voice comms with so many players on the same comms. Furthermore 40m raids tend to put less focus on individual performance.

Overall, 25m raids were a big improvement from 40m. If you have 15 too many ppl, then make your guild smaller.

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Arena is a circuit hosted by the steamwhedle cartel (gadzetan/ratchet/booty bay/everlook)

Compared to the bgs that open zones of conflict between the two biggest factions in the lore, arenas should be trivial in relevance compared to the second.

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True, but the Gurubashi trolls built the Arena in STV.

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Actually is not becouse if you want to be competitive you need to have a bigger roster compared to the raid size to cover people absence, but why this people should be benched especially that nowadays everyone pull is weight in raid?

Also a raid size increase doesn’t limit your performing capacity, you can rebalance the boss for the inclusion of 5< extra people keeping the fight engaging as it was in 2007.

Alsp with the fact we don’t have to worry of wbuffs, raids will easier to manage even if the raid sizes remains 40 people

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Again, you don’t need to bench them if you don’t have them in your guild. If you have 40+ ppl in your guild and raid size is 25m, either run 2 raid groups (using alts if necessary), or get rid of some people.

Sorry but no, as the recruitment officier of my guild, I don’t want to deal with 40m raids ever again after Vanilla is done. If you do, stay in Vanilla.

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And how you are going to cover people missing? Just Sunday we had to delay raid of 30 mins due of lack of healers even if we have 45+ raid team, the same happened on mine retail guild that we lost weeks of progress on mythic N’Zoth due of having 20 raiders and some of them where not always aviable

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Just have a bench of, like, 4-5 people max. 25m raids can do with a much leaner bench than 40m raids, especially if some of the raiders have geared alts (which is much more common in TBC than it is in Classic).

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Still there is not need to have 25 man raids on constant that will cleared slightly slower compared to classic.

Also this recruitment problem is a no problem due of people being totally able to do their job in raid making hard to reject a trial.

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I don’t even understand what you’re trying to say here. “25 man raids on constant”?

The recruitment problem lies not with having to reject a trial or not. The recruitment problem lies with the fact that, as the raid size increases, it becomes harder and harder to exactly predict what you’ll need.

If I had to recruit for a 10m raid, for example, it’d be easy to find a solid core of 10 people that will always be on and ready for the raid. Sure, I might need maybe 1 bencher to be safe, but it might not even be that necessary.

By contrast, when recruiting for 40m raids, you need at least 5 ppl on your bench, if not more, and there can be significant fluctuations in what you have from one raid to another. In fact, the bigger the raid size is, the bigger the bench actually needs to be, so it’s the opposite of what you’re trying to say - 25m raids actually make it easier to run a smaller bench than 40m raids.

Also, I wish you wouldn’t forget the other issue I pointed out before - namely, that I really don’t enjoy being on voice comms with 39 other people as opposed to 9 or 24.

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https://classic.warcraftlogs.com/server/rankings/5015/1005#metric=progress&partition=3

Statics speak for us, TBC will have a great success rate like classic, there is no need to reduce raid size (it was choice back them to increase success rate and push personal responsibility, but now people don’t sleep in malchezar infernals or fail to click magg cube)

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As I said, for the last time, there are multiple reasons why ppl prefer smaller raids. If you don’t like it, then don’t play. Blizzard won’t change a thing anyway since they have no devs on the Classic team, only programmers. And you’re one of the reasons why I’m glad it will stay this way

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I will play it the same as I am playing classic and retail at the same time.

But still in a modern raid environment there is no need to lower raid size in raid probably untilly a Classic Cataclyms (which is very unlikely)

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What does it even mean “in a modern raid environment there is no need to lower raid size”? There is no need to raise it either. You have literally made no decent case for why 40m raids are somehow better. Your only point so far has been benches and that point is moot because you still need a bench for 40m raids - even moreso than 10m or 25m raids. Right now my guild does have a 10-15 ppl bench - if we were doing 25m raids instead, 4-5 ppl at most would be plenty.

And besides, as I said before, the entire logic of this thread is flawed. TBC isn’t made for people who prefer Vanilla to TBC. TBC fans don’t give a damn if you don’t like flying mounts, 25m raids, no world buffs, arenas, and so on. If you don’t like them, suck it up or leave. I didn’t like world buffs in Classic and I still played it without going on and asking for them to be removed because I understand that Classic was made for ppl who prefer Vanilla, not for ppl (like me) who prefer TBC or WotLK. You might think Vanilla is perfect and needed no changes, but that’s not really the case - at least for a lot of people.

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Maybe you should stick to retail / classic… especially if you want all these changes lmao.

We have issues with our roster atm, simply because keeping 40 people happy is a lot harder than keeping 25 people happy.
It’s a lot easier for guilds to recruit and have a stable raid roster with lower numbers as well.

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