Well, one can interpret “- thread” to imply everything a forum is meant for.
It’s the actions he’s shown overall that indeed hints that he’s misunderstood the purpose of it altogether though.
I’ve looked at the support article on this and it says you can give feedback and suggestions on the forums and via the ingame system. I doesn’t give a specific forum though it just links to the index, and I have seen Blue posters give the only option to be used should be the ingame one.
Well, as with everything “Blue”, their stance is always rather vague. Kind of like to not outright condemn something sometimes even though it can fall under the (vaguely phrased) rules, but also not confirm something.
As for that link, it just refers to how the collective body of players can indeed provide feedback via the forum, and basically everywhere on the forum, which includes but is not limited to suggestions.
But because it’s a forum, it’s not a direct channel for just one poster to suggest something with it implying some sort of protection against people presenting counterarguments. A forum is meant for discussions, as you said. So they can collect the discussions, compile it into statistics and so on, to send it to HQ in NA as aggregate data and then call it a day.
There are multiple departments of various job types that then takes the data and sort it out to present their own analysis of it.
So it’s not exactly right to say that suggestion threads shouldn’t be created, it is however wrong to assume suggestion threads are a direct link to Blizzard with no room for debate in the thread.
That’s exactly how it’s supposed to work. In order to get more honor and faster ppl gather in premades because there is the same chance to fight against other premades or PUGs. There is no abuse in that.
Also, your proposed “solution” doesn’t make it better for pvp, it makes it better for ppl who want to solo Rank up while making it harder for ppl who dedicate themselves to it. It’s a bad design choice and the reason Classic exists to begin with.
Its not only the frustration trying to type while you have to fight. It is also the fact that random guys often don’t listen. “Guys report and defend”. Farm has been attacked…
I’ve played 5 ABs today. We won 4 of them. Lost (2000-1400) to a premade. A low ranked (6-8) really bad premade. But still we lost
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Your the only one here being defensive and being butthurt when you made a post on a PUBLIC forum asking for opinion.
So when you call people kids and other various insults whilst trying to take the moral high ground over a video game discussion you come off as extremely petty and pathetic.
Your idea’s were bad and full of assumptions made by you from your first person experience and thats why your idea’s are bad because your assuming that you have had the exact same experience as the other 99.99% of wow players who engage in BG’s.
Your trying to change a system that you have no attempted to make full use of and by that I mean you only complain about queueing solo and being forced into premade games but never once have you mentioned that you have joined a premade and still had bad experiences so you being anti social and just down right lazy is hurting your point more than actually helping it.
People would be more open to your idea’s if you had spent longer on your post that didn’t just end up coming off as one big vent with a woe is me vibe but because you continue to do nothing but engage in defensive and deflect tactics instead of actually addressing others opinions.
we wont listen to your idea’s anymore than you will listen to ours so until your ready to get off your high horse and realize your idea wasn’t 100% foolproof and actually attempt to discuss it you might aswell close this topic until your ready to discuss like an adult rather than a petty whiney child.
If your whole idea for this forum post was to get premades forced into seperate lobbies then your in for a rough time because the vast amount of players especially premade players wont go for it at all so your wasting your breath.
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I find it hard to believe you do not understand the difference but sure I will try to elaborate :
Forming a raid to do a raid is normal as that is what raids are made for thus you play within the nominal parameters , I do not think I need to emphasize you are going against mobs and not players and that if you are not vastly over geared raids still hold some challenge (the challenge they were meant to)
The equivalent of PvP would be for pre-made “raids” to face other premade “raids”, allowing premade “raids” to go against “pugs” 9/10 times is basically cheating and I elaborate :
Cheating is using unfair advantage negating any skill required to “beat” the game.
That is the very definition of premades vs pugs, as they rolfstomp the “raid” environment and gain loot (via rankings , honor , rep) within 6-8 minutes and thus are basically abusing the system (or lack thereof) and gain what is practically Free awesome gear.
Since they are willing to form premades , they should be willing to wait for the que to match them against premades , negating the “cheating” part and bringing back the challenge as it supposed to be.
Same goes for pugs, pugs vs pugs (if not vastly undergeared / skilled) poses a challenge even if you loose, you get to adapt on strategies and there is always some loss / gain of ground.
The above is not the case vs premades, there is nothing you can do when you loose 5 bases, the enemy team has 100% of the kills and 0% - 1% of losses , you get blitzkrieg so fast due to co-ordination and class combo (healers / warriors, cough cough) that you do not have the ability nor time to adapt.
How is it NOT cheating ?
Even if you allow 5 man to que up , let them face another 5 man to que , simple
Judging by the fact that over 90% of the games are against premades it is apparent that there is no lack of them , so why pit premades vs pugs ?
Again : I can deal with the frustration (and I am glad you get how frustrating it is) but not cheating, and technically (for reasons explained above) Pugs vs premades is Cheating due to unfair advantage and negation of challenge
“That’s exactly how it’s supposed to work. In order to get more honor and faster ppl gather in premades because there is the same chance to fight against other premades or PUGs. There is no abuse in that.”
What do you mean that is how it is supposed to work ? are you kidding ? people are supposed to form premades to farm pugs ? ? ? and basically cheat ? Why not go against premades ? ? ? only someone that wants free , easy wins would like that
What you are saying is that premades are supposed to get what is practically free loot ?
the chances are definitely not the same, we would not be going 9/10 against premades if that was the case , simply cause premades are not matched vs premades.
The “solution” brings challenge back, makes you actually work for your loot, and no gathering a premade is not all you need to do spamming ab/wsg winning 100-0 in under 8 minutes .
That statement would be the equivalent of “I used the cheat code , I deserve to win the game” no , no you do not.
Getting the best of PvP gear should be challenging, Pugs vs premades pose no challenge at all, it is the most hassle free gear you can have.
Thus premades should be willing to face premades only.
Even if what you stated was true , players that now form pugs could solo que if they wanted to “have it easier” as you state , they would still get to PvP but they would face a challenge as they would not be with 13 other friends to roflstomp everything in minutes.
Keeping the system as is will make many get the top gear and quit classic as they would have little to do , and many more to quit classic out of frustration , like some of my friends and guildies have.
Not everyone is willing to take the 9/10 abuse just cause some people want, hassle free wins
You mean like the Alliance did in phase 2?
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How did that happen ? and yes if they were vs premades all the time, of course! it does not matter the faction you play! you should not be vs premades as pugs
Wrong.
Also wrong.
Wrong.
Illogical and self-serving argument.
Wrong.
It’s part of the design of PvP as a whole, regardless of the game. The focus on absolute fairness in online games where there’s no difference whatsoever is a community-driven agenda made popular via esports. Doesn’t apply to MMORPG though, those are fundamentally about individual differences built up over time.
As for PvP, there’s no inherent “fairness” to a matchmaking without rating. Because any difference in skill, regardless if it’s a premade or not, and because the game has job roles such as healer, melee dps or ranged dps and then even further differences between each class & race, this means that you can’t quantify an absolute “fair” matchup.
Ever.
Especially not with such a stupid and flimsy metric like only how large the group that’s queuing is.
The game was designed in a way where certain things shines more than others depending on the situation while in other situations it’s vice versa, and even talents follows that principle. It’s called situational usage.
They haven’t even been able to get rid of it in retail yet, there’s still the stereotypical debate about “ranged vs. melee” advantages & disadvantages.
This is because it’s not an FPS where everyone starts with the same things. It’s not a board game where everyone starts with the same things, like chess for example.
So this is why a bad premade will get stomped just as much as a bad randomly matchmade team, while a good randomly matchmade team has the inherent potential to stomp just as much as a premade. The odds of it happening is slim because it requires more of each person and luck with the setup, but it’s not impossible.
AV stomping by horde after premades were made much harder to pull off on the alliance side is a good example of this effect.
There’s so much sophistry in your posts, I’m surprised you haven’t been arrested yet for trying to skew the interpretation of a law that differs from the legal definitions. (Or maybe you have? idc)
That’s why.
It isn’t. Not even close to it. Learn the definition of cheating in games before you say such stupid nonsense.
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I explained the reasoning and login.
all you could muster was in every point"wrong" , please do amuse me and try to elaborate.
“social design” lets go again
2 kinds of people :
Those who solo que and those who do not ?
Why not pit solo quers against each others and premades against each other ? there is your social design , anything else is just BS to justify easy wins with no challenge.
Oh yes cause removing any challenge for the game and having unfair advantage is NOT cheating.
Ok keep defending the current system mate , it is obvious you like 0 challenge and free loot.
Lets play a shooter, my team will use hacks , yours will not , do not cry about it however , IT IS SOCIAL DESIGN.
Farewell
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There’s so much dumb & ignorant crap in this quoted post I’m not even gonna bother with anything other than laughing really hard and feeling sorry for you at the same time.
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how is that remotely true? it is all about time investment in the classic honor system. the worst pvper can get rank 14 if they have the time to do so, and the working social surroundings of bracket stacking for example.
this system has it’s flaws, sure, but it is the vanilla/classic wow pvp system, so that’s what we have to deal with.
There’s so much dumb & ignorant crap in this quoted post I’m not even gonna bother with anything other than laughing really hard and feeling sorry for you at the same time.
If that was true it would be easy for you to explain and elaborate on the reasons why , of course you did not such thing basically all you said “nah you wrong brah” without being able to explain your logic nor have any arguments.
Again : amuse me , bring arguments to the table , present your logic and reason.
Seems your window of whatever device you’re using is too small and ended up scrolling past most of the post. Scroll up.
Either that or you simply don’t understand the post itself. See, this is why I’m laughing so hard and feeling sorry for you at the same time.
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Partly agree, it is a time investment, but do think that you invest your time to get owned 9/10 times.
Chances are you will never reach that rank while the opposite teams will do so as fast as possible.
The system is indeed flawed, thus all the requests to have the simple option of pugs vs pugs and premades vs premades, I really see no reason to not implement that.
Other than people wanting free easy wins that is
Oh you wrote so many things, yet no real arguments, just a flimsy comparison with shooters and yet somehow the fact that terribad players will loose anyway (by the way even very , VERY bad premades own normal pugs)
no worries I have not been arrested yet for making sense
you seem like you want to defend the premade vs pug situation so bad , simply cause you like roflstomping people with no challenge , good for you.
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So in other words you didn’t understand the post. Now I’m just feeling sorry for you.
Ok, now I’m laughing again. Google the meaning of ‘sophistry’.
and once again 0 arguments to counter mine, dude ok , we get it , you like roflstompings pugs, free wins, no challenge.
Its ok , It makes you feel good.
Google sarcasm , keep on laughing.
No point in trying to have a conversation we will not meet eye to eye.
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