OP seems mad.
“lassic Raids etc be then? huh? level 10? 5?”
Level squish won’t affect classic wow in any way so your argument is dumb.
Level squish is needed along with talents, spells rework.
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From my point of view the lvl squish is not that exciting, mostly it is just a visual thing. so 1 to 120 will be replaced with 1 to 60. But you can just change the number on the level line. Just divide every level by 2, So that will result in:
1 -> 1
10 -> 5
20 -> 10
30 -> 15
40 -> 20
50 -> 25
etc
120 -> 60
The only things that need to be fixed are things that show levels, but in the foreground you see level 60, but in the background it could still be level 120.
For the love of Metzen, would you guys please stop opening new threads on this? We’ve got three or four going already.
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Thanks but no thanks for stating my opinion for me. The only reason I haven’t bothered leveling my Kul Tiran druid as i acctually planned are not about the zones and the quests in the zones at all.
For me it’s about the feeling and sense of progression. Right now, even with heirlooms(but at a significantly reduced rate), you feel like your “de leveling” especially during the skill and talent draughts around 60-120.
For me as a Vanilla player that have done most zones more times then i remember 1-60 acctually still feels “fine”, however beyond this point it’s just a grind with nothing to look forward too. Except a couple of skills and talents with 15 or more levels in between.
A level squish whould from that perspective solve many of my current issues with leveling. Even if it whould take just as long or perhaps even longer, a level whould feel way more significant if it added something new to your character upon leveling up.
But since this is a change that won’t only concern myself, but also other players I try to see it from a full perspective.
120 levels feel daunting, if you have done the trip before you know it’s not “too bad” and “it goes fairly quick”. But if you never leveled up before 120 looks very far away… and it’s even further away if you don’t have heirlooms or knowledge on how to improve the “exp per hour” grind.
Next up it’s the heirlooms. If you don’t wear them. You will get de-leveled even harsher in the current “scaling zones” system. Even if you can equip new gear it’s soon useless again, making it feel like the gear don’t matter(This is acctually worse for heirloom users, since gear don’t matter at all for ~110-120 levels).
By a level squish it whould be possible to iron out these bumps which makes you feel “de-leveled” and also increase the value of each thing you do while leveling. If you find a piece of gear it will last longer, the feeling of distance between aquiring new skills and abilities will feel shorter(even if the experience required are the same)etc.
Even if humans can apply logic to any sort of argument, our feelings also take part. Sure I could level up by mass grinding enemies. Because that’s still the fastest way to level hands down, a bit faster if combined with a quest to cause this genocide of Elwynn boars. But who whould choose that option?
I can see alot of issues with a level squish, but it don’t take much for me to also see the positive aspect.
There were less realms at the start. You did have some with a large population.
Doomhammer, where I have been playing since vanilla has gone from a full realm to an empty one.
As for the vanilla experience, the private server you are talking about was really close to what vanilla was like. Yes you had bugs, but the funny thing is. It were the same bugs as vanilla had.
You never played vanilla, so how can you decide for people wether or not it was like vanilla?
Guys, can we take this over to Yes to the lvl squish!
The amount of seperate threads on this is getting ridiculous. Please keep it in one thread.
i doubt they will do this expansion,but next one it needs to happen,at this point its silly to have 130lvl. i welcome the ilvl squish
Don’t be so sure. Blizzard don’t usually throw things out unless they’re minded to do it.
They’re probably testing the waters for a squish and I think it’s got broad enough support. I think we will see it next expansion.
So far the only people that i’ve seen actively supporting it can’t even give me a single reason as to “Why” that they want it.
The only thing that they keep repeating is “Because there’s too many levels” or “We barely get anything for leveling up” which really isn’t that good of an argument when you, again, think it through.
If they made WoW 60, why did they make Diablo 3 60 as well?
Turns out 60 is just a really good number for the way Blizzard designs RPG’s, because of the amount of upgrades they put in, and beacuse of the amount of zones they put in. The original game expected you to level up in brackets of 10 levels for each zone, with some taking a bit less like Westfall and Redridge, so around 6-8 brackets, and the idea was to give you incredible variety and travelling time to go around and see a lot of zones, but to still give it structure to get new spells and abilities and powers every 60 levels, and provide a grander structure in when you could go to the next zone layered on top of that to spice up the visual variety when it was about to get stale.
Today, 6-8 zones have been replaced with 6-8 continents. We’re just running around to ridiculous amounts of outdated content, leaving it before we’ve even gotten our feet wet, and just having a miserable time because there’s no challenge.
Whatever level we squish level 60 players to? Seems pretty simple to me.
Probably not. I don’t think Blizzard wants classic raids to be hard again, so they’ll pull out various buffs or other mechanics to make it so, if for some reason the sheer stat difference doesn’t do it on its own. They’ve alrady done this; you do MASSIVE bonus damage against low level targets, and in raids it goes up even more.
Well that’s the big question. Levelling needs a lot of fixing, and I would argue that it cannot be fixed while the game has 120 or, God forbid, 130 character levels. It’s just too many.
Personally I’d prefer a more open-ended approach that still has statically scaled mobs and plenty of difficulty for those who go ahead of the questing curve and do orange or even red quests, and plenty of green quests for those who prefer that style.
I also don’t think the game needs to have us visit that many continents and zones in such a short period of time. I’d rather see less zones and get to dig into them a little bit more. I think the amount of XP we need is appropriate, but the levelling process gets too short because mobs are generally too easy to kill.
But all of that is things that need to be layered on top of the level squish. As far as the level squish itself is concerned, it likely won’t make any difference at all. It’s perfectly possible to just squish, and leave it at that. I won’t recommend Blizzard do this, but they could.
It pretty much can’t get worse than it already is. Twinks drove off all forms of low level PvP except twinking, and now that twinking was killed with the latest patch, the game can’t even find enough players to create a match, because that’s how much damage has been caused. It can only go up from here.
The two are completely unrelated.
Lv30. They’d be halving the amount of current levels so…
…Like that.
You’re right, It won’t. It’s a purely visual change. Leveling however would take twice as long.
You still won’t get anything new every time that you level up. You need the old talent system if you want to fix that.
For some levels perhaps… It may cause some problems with trying to solo legacy content closer to endgame e.g. WoD/Legion stuff.
Yup.
There are a lot of people that are arguing against a level squish in like three or four other threads. You didn’t need to open this one tbh.
How do you propose they can make older content not out-dated?
You would be very, very incorrect.
That’s true, I agree.
That’s a lie. Prove me wrong by giving me a source that proves your claims.
1: We weren’t killed off.
2: You’re scapegoating Twinks in to taking the blame for a situation that they did not create.
3: You can play PvP at low level still. It just takes far longer because they removed twinks who were merely speeding up the queue times.
Not you again…
Well, you can update it?
If you don’t want to do that though, and I understand why you wouldn’t since it’s a lot of content creation to do, you can … idk, squish the levels so it becomes optional?
That’s fine and you can have your point of view. I cba arguing with you about it anymore.
Because everyone literally writes down their reason for quitting.
Every time me or any one of my friends has tried to do low level PvP, we’ve been instantly frustrated with twinks. That’s all I can tell you. If that isn’t good enough for you, that’s fine. I cba arguing with you.
1: Great. Then why were all the twinks complaining about the queue split?
2: No, they just took advantage of Blizzard’s ridiculous systems design, hence why I’m blaming Blizzard for creating it and celebrating when they change it.
3: They were doing far, far more than merely speeding up queue times. It’s ridiculous to suggest that you didn’t cause frustration but stomping literal newbies trying to get into PvP.
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That’s the risk you take when you visit the forums… You tend to encounter people that also visit the forums.
How frequently? And in what way? By adding events or revamping the entire thing?
You can only do one level squish. It is not a miracle change that magically fixes any and all problems like how some people on this forum like to think it is.
It’s not an argument. You can give me a few good reasons why it’s impossible and i’ll give you a few good reasons why it’s not.
It’d be a civil conversation between two people in where both parties present facts that has a logical conclusion to it.
…Assuming that you keep deleting those swear-words before you post, of course. 
If I recall, Blizzard sends surveys to players that quit the game asking why they quit, so yes there is Data on that regardless on whether everyone answers those surveys or not. Surely some people do.
Not exactly a good source. Personal experiences tend to be biased and only account for a single instance. They can also more often that not be unable to be verified, or can be massively inflated. You can’t base an entire argument on them when said argument is about the bigger picture.
An eyewitness account can also be false due to the person giving it having been mistaken, for example: For all you know the person who killed you wasn’t a twink at all and just an enchanted heirloomer.
Are you really that dense? They’ve been complaining about it because Exp-locked battlegrounds do not proc at all.
…Looting gear is an abuse of system design? Golly, I better go and warn the Mythic+ players and Raiders.
It’s also ridiculous to suggest that I didn’t cause frustration when I stomped those same newbies in bgs at lv120, Or perhaps when I killed them in World PvP at lv120 or in Rated Arena at lv120.
This is such a bad argument.
Instead of crying about how you got stomped by a better player why don’t you just learn the game and become a better player yourself?
…Not to mention that this entire argument isn’t even applicable to just Twinks alone. “Newbies” are going to get stomped regardless of who they face unless they face another “Newbie”. That’s life.
I suppose, and obviously you have a right to be here. I’m just bored of quotewarring you.
I don’t know; I wasn’t arguing in favour of it.
But I can think of a couple of different of different ways. How much has happened, and how many assets do we already have?
But at the end of the day it just sounds like Cataclysm 2.0, so I don’t know if it’s worth it.
But I just don’t think it should be mandatory to run through 10-12 year old content. That’s all I’m saying. No more, no less.
No, it’s not. Never said it was. I said it’s an enabler. Among other things, it enables us to make more level overlaps because we have less levels to go through, and mobs within the zone will won’t need to have too massively different levels.
Of course scaling can chuck the whole thing out the window, but the problem is it also chucks most of the progression out of the window, which is the argument we had in the other thread, and I’ve already argued my case there and won’t bother again.
No, it’s not. I specifically claimed it wasn’t.
Oh no, I’m rude. 
Oh, so it did make twinks go away.
No, locking your XP at deliberate points in order to collect endless gear at a point where people are supposed to outlevel their gear as they accrue it is.
Now, I know that Blizzard deliberately implemented that. I’m suggesting that letting those people into the same room as the levellers was a mistake. Obviously, Blizzard agrees.
At level 120 you should expect people to have a fairly strong grasp of the game. They’ve played it for quite a while at this point and a most likely hooked regardless. At that point they can get over it.
First impressions are uniquely important, and that’s exactly what twinks are messing with.
Yes, let’s make the argument a personal attack now. I’m so rude.
The point is to try to make sure that’s what happens.
Thank you blizz,it was about time ,it should have been sooner but better them never,hope it comes next expansion even better in bfa.
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Me too tbh.
Let’s not do that then.
Yeah i’ll just not reply to this one lest we start the conversation from last post up again.
Not really. People are still twinking, just with enchanted heirlooms on fresh allied races. It’s never been easier to farm levelers tbh, or so I hear.
So it’s fine if they don’t out-level the gear? We must notify the aforementioned semi-twinks of this good news.
Newbies get a free instant lv110s, so that throws that argument pretty much out of the window. ![:confused:](https://d1bg94bbsh66ji.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/confused.png?v=6" ":confused:")
Then Twinks are the least of your problems.
I meant “You” are in “New players” and “People who are bad at PvP”, not you specifically unless you’re one of those two xD
That what’s what happens? Stomping “Newbies”?
Why do you want a Level Squish? What do you personally believe that it will change?
Technically, nothing. But since it technically changes nothing, we could also have 1200 levels but speed up leveling 10 times faster. Would that feel good?
Its about the feels, not about technical issues.
Everything is going to be the same, except we wont level up in an hour but get new skills every 10 levels, but we’ll spend 2 hours to level up and get new skills every 5 levels. It will feel like levels are more meaningful.
If you think its not going to change anything, you can just roll with it.
But we don’t. I also didn’t say that we should not find a solution that fixes an evergrowing level cap.
Keep that in mind for when it goes live and it doesn’t feel the way that you initially thought that it would so that I can tell you “I told you so”.
You need a proper talent system for leveling up to mean something again, and that talent system is the one that they got rid of. The one that actually gave you a point every time that you leveled up that made you feel like you were working towards the abilities that you got every 5-10 levels.
I do not want pointless changes being made for the sake of making changes.
I want changes that actually make the game better.
A level squish on its own will do no such thing.
If they’re going to do one then I want them to also give us the old vanilla-tbc-wrath style talent tree but with updated talents so that we get a point for every level that we gain ánd I want them to squish the levels specifically as I wrote them down:
Anything less or different than this will be a massive disappointment.
I didnt say you did. However you seem to be thinking that “evergrowing level cap” might need a solution.
lol ok.
Level squish wont bring 1 talent each level back, but its a start that reduces the intervals.
It will make the feeling better. Transmog doesnt technically change anything either, but it feels better to have it. Would you say no to more transmog, mounts etc?
So you even made new level and pvp bracket tables to your liking, you want the old talent system, but you’re against the level squish? Dude. You have to agree with us to get what you want, not oppose us.
I also want the old talent system, but this doesnt make me disagree with the level squish. When you want something changed, you gotta go step by step.
You wont get what you want with this attitude. Prepare to be disappointed.