Learn to read. But fine, I’ll throw you a bone. Read the report if you wish to learn the context behind it:
Tips for increasing shared goals
Share goals, not just shared rewards . Many game designers assume that if there is a shared reward, people will naturally align their activities. This might work if humans were hyper-rational, profit-maximizing automatons, but they are not. Instead, players benefit from clearly-stated goals and examples of how they might work together.
Public and private spaces . Large social groups are composed of sub-groups that require private space to reinforce vision and social norms as well as create opportunities for group bonding. They also need public space to display and reinforce the group’s overall identity.
Group vs. group content . Conflict with other groups is a common method of providing a shared purpose. Meaningful rivalries can play out over the course of months or years. Games with PvP content can create very rich social histories if they can operate at this scale.
Positive goals involving growth and support . Though it is easy to rely on competition in order to give your group a purpose, history is rich with high-longevity groups, usually in the form of religious communities, that exist to preserve a positive way of life. Consider how your game can be a positive refuge from the broader world. Many players will find this to be a worthy goal to dedicated their time toward.
In other words, your arguments follows the same flaws as depicted in the report. That “throwing bodies together” will automatically “make it better”, and that as long as there’s a “shared reward” then people will “naturally work together”.
The goal in a BG, is to win. Players in pugs, don’t want to win?
Its not black and white. Yes, a group of organized people, have more social elements. It doesn’t mean, that a random team is having non.
Do you play (Classic) in a premade?
Seems you still struggle to understand its implications and meanings.
To start with, now you’re confusing goals for rewards. That is not a guarantee, not everyone has the same goal. For example, most players asking for a non-premade matchmaking segregation, claims they just want to have “fun”. Fun doesn’t equal winning, fun doesn’t equal getting the rewards.
While rankers who are only focused on the rewards, have the goal set for themselves to get the rewards. Then you have individual differences of competitive spirit, and desire to win is different in each one, and it’s always subjected to outside influences. For example, if it goes badly, there are many who will quit trying before the BG is over. This is due to many outside influences such as not caring about your fellow players and not caring about struggling “to the bitter end”, and a basic lack of ambition to fight an “uphill battle”.
Shared rewards does NOT equal shared goals. As the report explicitly states.
Read the quotes. Then read the report. It will do you better than to spout ignorant BS about things you don’t comprehend.
I apologize it’s not a topic that can be so easily compressed into a single twitter post. Sorry, not sorry.
I still don’t agree. The difference is in the degree each element is present in these groups. You believe (?) that in pugs, there is zero of whatever a premade has. I disagree with that. Use different term instead of “solo”.
Also, the goal is to enjoy this game WITH other players. And thats the only criteria to change something or not. Encouraging people to form premades, did not work in Vanilla, and won’t work in Classic. People already mentioned that they can’t afford to play in premade. Most Vanilla players are now about 40 (I believe) and have families and jobs. If I am wrong and we are the minority, Blizzard should ignore us and allow pug vs premade “fun”.
Remake a character and play in the 39, 49, or 59 bgs instead. No premades in those bgs and 59 bgs is basically like playing at 60 anyways. Bgs at 60 are a waste of time. Av doesn’t have much premades but its boring AF.
It already has. How can people face so many premades if nobody was encouraged to form them? It’s just the crybabies asking for convenience because they got spanked who are vocal about it, the people in premades already are generally happy with it.
Very few Vanilla players play Classic. To assume the game was re-released for people who already played it is a big misconception.
Impossible to know if you’re a minority or not without official figures, but they obviously do allow it to continue. Vocal minorities are a thing.
This is completely false. Battlegrounds were not designed with the intention of “if you pug, you get annihilated every match”. You are straight up fabricating lies.
The vast majority of battlegrounds in vanilla (and other xpacs) were pug v pug. This was the intention.
Also, if premades are how Blizzard intend you to play WSG, then why have they implemented cross-server pugs yet premades are 1 realm only ?
Never said that. I said very clearly that it’s a punitive game design. To queue alone impacts your chance to win in a negative fashion, but it doesn’t decide it.
To break it down for you in a simple way, punitive game designs refers to punishing you with something negative to use that as a motivation to do what you can to avoid experiencing it again. It’s why 2d platforms can be designed in a way to send you back to the start if you die somewhere, to encourage you to play better so you don’t experience that punishment again.
So the punitive game design element of queuing alone in how it impacts your chance to win negatively, is meant by design to motivate you as a player to branch out socially to increase that chance to win.
It’s just that there’s an ingrained culture in gaming today, where people are rewarded without any real punishments involved. So many players have grown accustomed to only chasing the carrot but never suffering the stick, so now when they’ve brought back a design involving such a stick, this self-entitlement leads to many players just quitting instead of trying, and of course the all-time favorite to just cry about it until they get their bottle.
If you dont care about rank, you dont care about joining premade. Then, BGs are all about fun. If you think playing against premades if you’re a pug isn’t fun, then don’t play. There’s nothing more pathetic than the PvP player who joins a BG seeking out excuses for their loss.
Purely anecdotal, premades were a constant in Vanilla on many servers. Or else you wouldn’t hear about so many players having reached r14 in premades, in Vanilla.
The difference was that the realm-only matchmaking made the amount of premades compared to the amount of non-premade players more static overall, so you’d more consistently have X chance to face a premade at any time of the day and Y chance to face non-premades, instead of the constantly high chance to face a premade right now with this retail xrealm pool we’ve got in Classic.
The min-max mentality is also playing a big part in this frequency.
One can pretty safely assume most people play Classic for its PvE, the same as in retail. PvP is always the minority in WoW.
Yes, that’s exactly what it means. Participation trophies are horrible for everyone in the end. That’s how you got retail.
I agree, xrealm matchmaking needs to be removed. Or at the very least be reduced to proper vanilla battlegroup sizes with vanilla realm population caps.
Jep, the server I played on had in total 5 Premades, 2 Horde and 3 Alliance.
OF course they doged each other, but that left the Pugs still with a app. Quota of 60% Pug vs. Pug games.
edit: sry, thats just what you said. Yes, the proportion was different.
